Author Topic: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?  (Read 14595 times)

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Kuss

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Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« on: April 11, 2014, 10:21:13 PM »
Please discuss.

Kuss

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2014, 04:01:32 PM »
I thought for sure someone would take the bait on this question. I do find it funny though how much neo-cons think Obama has ruined the country or somehow has been the WORST PRESIDENT EVER. All the guy has done is pretty much keep the status quo with the exception of an alteration to the health insurance industry. In terms of deficits and debt, the worst year was actually Bush's budget, and the next couple years after that staying at around that level, with deficits falling now to around pre-financial meltdown levels. It's bad but not nation crippling. I do find it a little suspicious that none of these debt hawks were saying anything the eight years after Clinton left office with the budget projection to be able to pay down debt.


muddeer

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2014, 02:25:26 PM »
I thought for sure someone would take the bait on this question.

Troll!

reed23

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2014, 02:51:01 PM »
Obama has been one of the worst presidents in the history of this country.

muddeer

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2014, 09:15:03 PM »
Ok, I'll bite.  I'll give him a B- grade so far.  He's a smart guy with his heart in right place.  But he should've accomplished much more than he has, considering the state of the country when he took over.  This is because he's not a good politician, in the purest sense of the word.  He just don't know how to get others to do what he wants:  To be more specific, he doesn't know how to deal with all these crudgey old men in congress who are used to having their egos stroked and being treated like divas and prima donnas.

The problem is that Obama is just too young.  Sure, we had young presidents before, but they were not some middle-class black kid growing up in Hawaii, playing basketball.  Kennedy grew up surrounded by powerful men both in politics and business.  Clinton was a southern boy, who learned how to schmooze and fit in, to be one of the good-old boys, as a way of life.

I think Obama will be remembered as a C+ ~ B+ president.

Kuss

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2014, 02:12:48 AM »
Obama has been one of the worst presidents in the history of this country.

By what criteria?

Jones

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2014, 11:00:02 AM »
obama has not been a good president.  he mostly tries to do good but he has inadvertently furthered the divisions in our country.

if the president is someone republicans completely refuse to work with then he cant be an effective president.  and democrats cant just say 'thats their problem'.  it doesnt matter whose fault it is.  it is a problem for our whole country.  that is why obama hurt our country when he got re-elected and that is why hillary clinton should not run.  democrats should put someone forward who republicans will work with (white and male).

Kuss

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2014, 09:39:03 PM »
I don't think the Republicans refusal to work with Obama has anything to do with Obama. He spent the first two years trying to make nice with them when he really didn't have to and all it did was make him look weak.  Have you seen a Republican primary in the last 6 or 8 years? The redistricting of congressional seats within some states has created hyper-partisanship. There is no longer room for moderate voices in a lot of places. You see it sometimes on the left i.e Nancy Pelosi, but it's far more prevalent when it comes to Republican seats. If you're not pro-gun, pro-life,  pro-bible, pro-"American exceptionalism" and anti-gay, anti-climate change, anti-regulation, anti-government, well then you can expect to get primaried. They've turned a primary election into a bapting verb.

This past election we had people actually trying to articulate reasons why they're pro-life even in terms of rape. They've let the extremists hijack the party.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2014, 09:40:44 PM by Kuss »

Jozheg

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fran

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2014, 03:43:59 PM »
  How hard are the Russians laughing at this thread?

muddeer

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2014, 07:57:07 PM »
  How hard are the Russians laughing at this thread?

Why would the Russians be laughing?  Putin has had a bad couple of months.  Before, Ukraine was run by a pro-Russia government.  Now, Ukraine has a pro-West/US government, and it will remain so, with the ~1 million Russian-speaking voters in Crimea gone.  Would Obama have preferred to take 100% of Ukraine from Putin?  Sure, but 80% is better than 0.  It is Obama who's laughing.

Poor Putin, while securing his precious naval base, is now facing a recession at home (accomplished with no penalty to the EU or US).  Moreover Russia will have to financially support Crimea, which like almost all "red states" in US, took more money from the Ukraine federal government than it contributed.  And Russia will also have to make up for the food and the water (90%) that used to come from the rest of Ukraine into Crimea.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 08:01:41 PM by muddeer »

Jozheg

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2014, 12:24:59 AM »
Nope, we're not laughing. This time the US brings their proxy-war right into our heartland.
The territory formerly known as Ukraine has never been run by a pro-Russian government. It's always followed the genuine ukrainean politics of sitting on two chairs and milking two cows, while flying high the "we-are-not-Russians-let-us-into-the-civilized-world" flag.
The rest of your analytics makes zero sense to a Russian. We don't operate the terms and intentions you implied, your logic leads you to wrong conclusions regarding us, it's all about what you would be doing in our shoes.

muddeer

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2014, 10:29:15 AM »
Which of the following statements are not correct?

-Yanukovych was supported and largely voted into office by Russian-speakers/supporters in Ukraine.

-With Crimea gone, no anti-West/pro-Russia government will be elected in Kiev.

-Russia is now expecting 0% or negative GDP growth for 2014.

-Crimea took more money from Kiev than it contributed into the national coffer.

-Crimea was a net importer of food and water from the rest of Ukraine.

Only analysis I made is that the West/US so far gotten the better of this Ukraine mess; Russia and Putin are the losers.  I never said that it is right or wrong, or Putin had any other choice then to take over Crimea.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 10:31:32 AM by muddeer »

Jozheg

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2014, 11:46:34 AM »
Alright, since you're talking angels and I talk airplanes, let's continue in the same manner.
You throw the rings, I pick up only those that ended up on my stake.
So.
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Which of the following statements are not correct?
-Yanukovych was supported and largely voted into office by Russian-speakers/supporters in Ukraine.
This statement lacks any logical link with your previous post's theses. I'm not here to parry every of the thoughts that come up in your mind.
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-With Crimea gone, no anti-West/pro-Russia government will be elected in Kiev.
Another meaningless axiomatic statement as before, bears no signs of development into dialectical analysis performed by both of us in a course of interaction. Ignored.
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-Russia is now expecting 0% or negative GDP growth for 2014.
Yet another statement, absent in the original message. This is not a table tennis with a ball on every swing, only 1 ball at a time must be in game.
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-Crimea took more money from Kiev than it contributed into the national coffer.
False. The mere presence of the naval base you're so worried about, cashed in for more than 250 billion dead presidents for urkainean budget (in rent fees and gas price discounts) over the course of 23 years.
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-Crimea was a net importer of food and water from the rest of Ukraine.
True.
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Only analysis I made is that the West/US so far gotten the better of this Ukraine mess; Russia and Putin are the losers.  I never said that it is right or wrong, or Putin had any other choice then to take over Crimea.
Wrong. Russia had zero game in Ukraine. Can't lose when you do not bet.

muddeer

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Re: Barack Obama: Great President? Or the Greatest President?
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2014, 12:43:42 PM »
Huh?  What are you talking about?  The only "previous post's theses" I made is that the West/US has gotten better end of this conflict than Russia.  And the facts that Kiev now has a pro-West government, when it had a Pro-Russian one just a couple of months ago, and will remain so for a long time to come, are absolutely relevant to that thesis.  Moreover, Russia is the loser so far because of the economic damage from the sanction threats/aid to Crimea and the decreased influence over Ukraine.

I am not sure what you are arguing here.  You yourself said that Russians are not laughing over this Ukraine crisis.  So in fact you are in agreement with me regards to fran's comment.