Author Topic: Stats -- Next Wipe  (Read 5955 times)

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Ken_Rawr

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #30 on: January 31, 2014, 10:27:13 PM »
I seem to remember the mention scouts will be removed and oldschool rangers back.. if so then will rangers be pure dex based dam while bowing like thieves or dex+str?

Terk

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #31 on: February 07, 2014, 11:42:54 AM »
Obviously this would be a lot of change, but I'm not sure what direction it takes player characters/mob characters. Can we get a big picture view of the reasoning behind the changes? It seems like we're leaving D&D, but I'm not sure exactly how to interpret these changes without a context of the goal.

Based on the changes proposed we could essentially be going any direction: players could be getting on average weaker, staying the same, or become significantly stronger. Maybe they are going to be stronger in PVE but weaker in PVP?

What matters to me and what will help me evaluate these suggested development steps is understanding the goal for players.

Generally, what I would gravitate to is making players much stronger from a PVE perspective, dropping group limit to 6, and weakening PVP potential (since PVP potential has seemed to be too high this wipe in a few specific areas.)

Aristox

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #32 on: February 11, 2014, 03:30:30 PM »
I seem to remember the mention scouts will be removed and oldschool rangers back.. if so then will rangers be pure dex based dam while bowing like thieves or dex+str?

We haven't gotten that far yet.  Class design is after base system design.  Can't build a house without a foundation.

Aristox

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #33 on: February 11, 2014, 03:44:52 PM »
Obviously this would be a lot of change, but I'm not sure what direction it takes player characters/mob characters. Can we get a big picture view of the reasoning behind the changes? It seems like we're leaving D&D, but I'm not sure exactly how to interpret these changes without a context of the goal.

Based on the changes proposed we could essentially be going any direction: players could be getting on average weaker, staying the same, or become significantly stronger. Maybe they are going to be stronger in PVE but weaker in PVP?

What matters to me and what will help me evaluate these suggested development steps is understanding the goal for players.

Generally, what I would gravitate to is making players much stronger from a PVE perspective, dropping group limit to 6, and weakening PVP potential (since PVP potential has seemed to be too high this wipe in a few specific areas.)

I am not going to lay out the whole plan here.

Lets leave at this:

-One of our goals is to increase PvP survivability, so fights last longer than a couple seconds even 3 vs 1, without making killing a character impossible. 
-Another of our goals is to increase the availability of +stat gear, so equipment means more across all levels of the game (1 to 30 and causal newbie to hardcore addict).

There are a lot more, but those 2 seem relevant here and to the discussions we have exposed so far.  Later discussion will reveal more.

Kragg

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #34 on: February 13, 2014, 12:26:12 PM »
I like basically everything contemplated but want to add my voice to those who will miss rolling characters and miss the minor race differences (magic save vs bash modifier etc) that confront one during character design.  These aren't the biggest deal to me but these early investments and choices help attach one to a character I think.

Great work.

Steve.

Brafu

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #35 on: May 11, 2014, 01:34:09 AM »
I like the idea of not having to roll anymore, but I wouldn't if I didn't feel like there would be a way to make my character different from someone else or to put my own unique touch on it (I normally liked to go with weird stat mixes for my tanks).

It seems like the general idea with the proposed changes is to, as stated, make stats more important, but also to give people more room to have a semi-unique character to suit their playing style. I like it.

reed23

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #36 on: June 19, 2014, 07:55:22 PM »
Last development post May 11th.  Hows development???  Hopefully as good as your golf game

btown

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #37 on: June 20, 2014, 06:32:25 AM »
444444444444

reed23

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #38 on: June 20, 2014, 08:26:29 AM »
Even par, not bad.

Jones

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #39 on: June 22, 2014, 04:41:09 AM »
And in fresh news - Next wipe you will not have to grind useless skills for hours and days.  For a large price your guildmaster will be able to teach any skill to superb. 

muddeer

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #40 on: July 19, 2014, 07:19:38 PM »
Well, count me as one of those who has some trepidation with these suggested changes.  Arctic is my all time favorite game, any kind of game.  But there are two things in it that I have always thought needed improvement:  Limited character development options and too much emphasis on gear.  Seems to me, the LUBE changes will make these "problems" worse, not better.

Rolled stats, class, race, and gear used to be the only ways to develop your character (since no one role plays) and differentiate yourself from others.  Once you've started out as a goblin thief, how different from other goblin thieves can you get?  The addition of rank/legend system increased the number of variables available to players to play with and create characters interesting to them.  Yet compare to many other RPG's, options in Arctic are much more limited, say compare to AD&D 3.5 with its multi-classing and open skills system.  Now you want to take away stat rolling and racial differences?

These changes will make what I see as too much emphasis on gear even worse.  I remember Adam saying several years ago, the reason he wanted to introduce the rank system in Arctic was to reduce the players' reliance on gear; reduce the time people spent popping decays, etc..  I don't think it helped much (and it won't, unless players have to trade gear slots for ranks).  For most classes, their effectiveness is highly dependent on their equipment.  Many players are too afraid of losing their sets and hesitant to explore zones, take chances on a hard mob or PVP.  And all that trudging your clan has to go through repopping decays.  This emphasis on gear is also a part of the problem Arctic has, of not being able to cater to both casual and hardcore gamers.  And LUBE is suppose to emphasize stats and stats will be determined by gear?

Some of the changes proposed for the LUBE sounds good to me, like making classes less specialized (result is akin to multi-classing).  But reducing the number of variables that are available to players for character development and having them have to depend on their gear more than ever doesn't seem like improvements over the old Arctic.

Alecto

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #41 on: July 21, 2014, 01:19:59 PM »
@muddeer
some of this is a question of perspective.  Perhaps you'd like to be able to choose body-type (thick ones are slow and strong, thin ones are fast and weak) or hair-color, or have greater race diversification in the "build" of your character.  A lot of people would hate/not care about it at all, just what impact it had on their goals for their character (be able to one-hand heavy weapons, have a chance to avoid a bash).  My understanding is that gear will basically do all the building you want now.  Yes, there will still be super-elite gear and the GREED, but those sharp short swords won't be as useless as they have been in the past.  You decide if you are going heavy armor high hp (i.e. a tank) or high str light armor (pure damage) or dual-wield light armor (DPS).  A warrior can be any of these: how you craft the character with your eq choices will decide what sort of character it is.

Besides, arctic is one of the MOST customizable game in the world, at least in terms of character appearance.  Just choose option 2 - change your description - from the login and have at it.  I think you will notice most people don't even bother...

Myte

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #42 on: July 21, 2014, 08:06:19 PM »
@muddeer
Totally agree.

@alecto
Clearly he's referring to the functional variable stats of the character and has nothing to do with 'looks', are you serious?

jingo

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #43 on: July 28, 2014, 05:28:52 PM »
Well, count me as one of those who has some trepidation with these suggested changes.  Arctic is my all time favorite game, any kind of game.  But there are two things in it that I have always thought needed improvement:  Limited character development options and too much emphasis on gear.  Seems to me, the LUBE changes will make these "problems" worse, not better.
It's interesting because I enjoy Arctic's emphasis on gear.  Gear is one of the few things I find fun in RPGs to actually obtain.  Skills, gold, exp?  Games never properly reward you for trying something difficult.  Instead your best way to play is to kill the same shit that is never hard over and over again.  I'm not even sure it's possible to fix this problem because I've never even heard of an RPG that did.

Gear, on the other hand, has no such issue.  It doesn't matter how many shitty rings you pop, it will never magically turn into that badass ring.  Which gives me a reason to try things that are hard.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2014, 05:33:01 PM by jingo »

Attai

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Re: Stats -- Next Wipe
« Reply #44 on: August 03, 2014, 08:25:01 PM »
My biggest complaints with Arctic have always been the same

1) Arctic is so gear dependent that when you deadbeat you lose all your gear and you're screwed.  I've quit a couple of wipes because of longer than intended absences (work and family related) causing me to deadbeat.
2) Arctic is very end loaded and for the most part the game doesn't get fun until you're at least lvl 30 and you keep changing the tables to make it harder.