Author Topic: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.  (Read 916 times)

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Kir

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Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« on: July 09, 2017, 11:54:38 AM »
We are all sitting in discord reminiscing at how this game used to be a amazing. It is not competitive anymore. Rise dominates when Rise plays. The #1 hypothesis by our critics is that Rise dominates because we go "full nerd mode" in the first few weeks.

Well I am here to tell you that that thinking is flawed. Rise does not dominate because we go "full nerd mode". Rise goes "full nerd mode" because that is what it takes to dominate. "Winners focus on winning, losers focus on winners." This is why we win. This is why we win every wipe, and I dont think that will ever change.

HOWEVER

If you still believe that Rise only wins because we go "full nerd mode", meaning we spend lots of hours playing to pop choice gear\spells... then why not change the GAME to allow everybody the potential to reach Rise\end game in much less time?

Several ways this can be accomplished:
1) change xp requirement to lvl 30 back to 90 million as in the TERK days.
2) make all items 50-100% load based on zone diffuculty
3) make books\spells 50-100% load based on zone diffuculty
4) put prism\pws back on mobs like lord noom
5) remove requirements for legend- IE, once you hit rank 4 and can buy "legendary player", you can be legendary.

Yes its true, all those methods will help rise as well. However, rise is going to be end game and dominate regardless. With this way, smaller clans would have a chance. As it is now, the spell% and gear loads are so shit that the only way you can become end game is grinding your ass off. Except now if any other clan wants to become end game they wont have the equipment rise has.

I'll give a few examples of why my ideas would work.

Day 2 of this wipe rush, myth beat Rise to storms. But load % are such shit, they didn't get any good items. In my purposed system, they'd have gotten all the good gear and then have been able to use that gear to progress to the next level of zoning. Instead they didn't, rise then popped the choice items and was able to power up and move on to the next tier of zoning.

Day 3-4: ilya clan beat rise to verminaard\fiesel and were able to pop wyrmslayer, however in my purposed system they would have popped the robes of darkness and a fat cleric spell, significantly changing their ability to fight us.

Its now several weeks into the wipe, and most casters from clans other than rise are NON-legend. Which means they have absolutely no chance against us. In my purposed system this would all change. Also I would bring back the ability the ambush as well. Bring back teleport, fix hunt and temp path. One big ambush against Rise and everything changes.

I think this is the only way to save mud. People nowadays do not want to pk. But its not because they are 30-50 years old or have kids\jobs\wives. Its because it takes 3 months to grind a decent character and 5 seconds to lose it in pk. My method fixes that.

Save the mud before its too late. This no pk, whining and crying shit, is absolutely disgraceful, and a lot of good people worked way too hard on this game to let it become so pathetic.

blackmagus

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2017, 12:13:47 PM »
The MUD is finally transitioning to no PK or controlled PK and once that problem is solved, then the load rates should be re-examined.

The game isn't a problem because people can't level up or find gear. It's because clans like RISE run them off the server because they want to dominate at all costs.

newbie123321

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2017, 12:23:47 PM »
I agree if you just made it so people had to spend less time just grinding bullshit they would be less stress out because it takes way to long to get to 30 for people who clearly don't have much time to go FULL NERD MODE, and just play a game because they have the time to.? Exp caps should be reduced by a lot and NOW you're going to make it hard to pk? so pretty much your challenging people to PK. Very confusing bapting messages. Good thing people already just quit to go back to playing games that are PVP and don't get punished for having playing a game they like a lot by playing a lot because they have the time to play games because they have dope lifes. I know! Why not just restrict the time each IP has to play the game because you clearly don't want people playing the game. In Fact you want to discourage them by saying there nerds because they have more time than you..... Or just give out tickets to your BFF's so only they can show up to the game you clearly don't want others to play so we stop looking like assholes when we show up to play a game you clearly don't want us playing...OR just make 2 servers one for PVE and for PVP so once again you have no reason to blame pkers for pking. Also Jorquin you did only manage to imm cheat kill a clan who was just grouped with RISE or as you said "associated" with RISE so basically you killed a clan for just grouping with RISE who did not do anything to your best friends nas and tis. So good job for being the very thing you "think" you're trying to stop, you hypocrite.

newbie123321

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2017, 12:32:47 PM »
Blackmagus, what are you talking about? People got ran off the mud because they don't have the best gear in the game because they got pked for having the good gear because that is what this game has always been about? Are you mentally retarded? When you get pked, you cry to Jorquin about bots when you died on your bot ip character. You're just dumb and bad at this game. You also want to play a PVE game by yourself without people who are better than you so that YOU can have the good eq. Your just a complete troll who spurts out nonsense. Controlled PK? Oh my god shut the bapt up its just not going to be no PK and just more about playing dungeons and dragons and holding hands. The last PK you are ever going to have had Blackmagus is getting rekt and crying to your friend who runs the mud. 

blackmagus

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2017, 12:42:12 PM »
Yes, spending hours or days loading low % or limited gear, only be told you have to give it up or the clan would war you. Or better yet, not only kill you for it but repeatedly target your clannies until they quit because they're not allowed to play the game is the RISE way.

PK can be structured through immortal intervention to allow fights in a controlled environment. If randoming is not allowed and the scorched earth play style of your confederates is done away with, players will not only return, but stay.

newbie123321

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2017, 12:46:38 PM »
There is a group of people who cry about not playing because RISE plays and they are making the choice to not play, because they have no time to get to end level shit quick enough and so it is a problem. If they could get more people to end level fast enough, they would be able to get the eq to stand a chance or always have numbers to stand a chance when they lose a war and need to make new characters fast because they have no time to go NERD MODE! because they just lack the time. Which is true see if you could just get another character you wouldn't have to cry to Jorquin that you are going to quit playing forever because they killed the bot/character you took so much time leveling because it in fact DOES take along time to level and have a end game character, you see BLACKMAGUS can you even try to understand how your just a horrible player and ruin this game for people because you suck at this game.

blackmagus

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2017, 01:00:17 PM »
And therein lies the problem; the mentality that no one else is good enough and doesn't deserve to compete against RISE simply because they're better players.

RISE has a couple of great zoners and a lot of good follows/bots. RISE also has a couple of sociopaths who get their kicks out of winning at all costs and then deep-renting whenever their targets quit for the wipe. Changes such as those being enacted are meant to curtail the destructive activities and to encourage the zoners and other players to come out of hiding or to rejoin the game where they can play with little change of random persecution.

Yes, your clan is going to scream about cheating, about unfair bias against them but it's all crap. Even when your own members have proposed limiting their PK activity, it has never lasts. Now the admins in the game are making changes to force that change.

Welcome to the new era.

Kir

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #7 on: July 09, 2017, 01:36:08 PM »
And therein lies the problem; the mentality that no one else is good enough and doesn't deserve to compete against RISE simply because they're better players.

RISE has a couple of great zoners and a lot of good follows/bots. RISE also has a couple of sociopaths who get their kicks out of winning at all costs and then deep-renting whenever their targets quit for the wipe. Changes such as those being enacted are meant to curtail the destructive activities and to encourage the zoners and other players to come out of hiding or to rejoin the game where they can play with little change of random persecution.

Yes, your clan is going to scream about cheating, about unfair bias against them but it's all crap. Even when your own members have proposed limiting their PK activity, it has never lasts. Now the admins in the game are making changes to force that change.

Welcome to the new era.

Lol the new era does nothing to Rise, only diminishes arctic's legacy. I cant think of a single item that anybody in Rise has that we got from pk. We have several 12+ dam bashers, a few nobash casters and two dragon orbs. None of these items were attained in pk.

I honestly feel bad for you that you think the no_pk thing hurts Rise.. in fact it only helps us. Within 30 minutes of it being enacted we already planned many ways which in fact this makes us stronger. We haven't gotten any real gear in pk in like 2-3 wipes. And now we can afk in zones as long as we want without worry of ambushes. You see what you still do not comprehend is that we strive to be the best and became the best. We did that with zoning AND pk. Now pk isn't part of it, so what, we are still the best at zoning, teamwork, we have the smartest leaders and best players. It matters not, in fact it just lowers the chances that we actually ever lose any gear. Good luck buddy. We have a legacy that began in 2012 and will likely not end in the next decade or two.

blackmagus

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #8 on: July 09, 2017, 01:52:31 PM »
Great. We all win then. RISE plays by the rules, new clans can form and zone peacefully and everyone is happy.

Glad you've seen the light.

oom

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #9 on: July 09, 2017, 02:38:15 PM »


RISE has a couple of great zoners and a lot of good follows/bots.

I see this type of thinking a lot. The number one reason RISE is so good at this game is because this isn't the case. Everyone in this clan has a role that they take and they crush the role they have.

I have been in a few clans other than RISE and MYTH and with the exception of those 2 clans every clan was a few stacked guys at the top with stacked alts and fodder using misty long sword. When I was CORE I loved the zoning but hated the fact that I would end up with better eq and coins by soloing because I wasn't allowed to bapting LORE an elite item let alone wear it.

When I joined RISE I felt like I was welcomed as a brother. I got to lead a rush group my first rush with the clan and even now I sometimes get to show them my secret MYTH ranks while leading a group.

EVERY main character we have is equally stacked. EVERY main character is given opportunities to get swapped in for rank runs even if they aren't currently useful enough for the end fight.

We treat each other like bro's and we don't leave people behind. You won't find a naked RISE, not because we have all of the eq but because the leaders of this clan gladly share the love with everyone. This in turn makes us EQUALLY committed to being the best.

I used to care about my individual eq or accomplishments when I was in other clans because that's what everyone else focused on. With RISE I don't care if I'm walking around with a macabre set(not saying i dont' love being nobash dragon orb guys - thank you) and if we manage to load the robes of darkness for Reed it's as big of a win for me as for him.

In my mind THAT is why we have 'won' the 2 wipes I've played with them.

Jorake

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2017, 03:17:05 PM »
I was the one who lead the myth group to storms day 2 of wipe. I can certainly agree with the statement we didnt get the good shit lol. And i was thinking the entire time "those bapters were already here I guess".

I think the difference is, myth wasn't trying to rush to beat anyone else. We were "rushing" just to get a few good things and level up and just in general having a good time playing. The downfall for Myth in a rush situation is the "i'm scared to do that" mentality. And that's ok. Alot of those guys dont remember doing glymmer on a group of level 24-25s years ago. So its fine.

I also agree with the legend thing and exp scale back. Grinding to 30 is easy but bothersome. Legend when you hit rank 4. Then you must get those skills and spells to acquire the ranks for them. That would be an interesting concept.

I've said this before though. And I even asked goodtim about it. Why does rise ONLY ambush people? You are leaps and bounds ahead of everyone else. But you still ambush. His answer was something along the lines of "that's a good question and im not really sure". That is the only reason I dont want to war with rise. It's not the eq. It's kind of the spells a bit. But its because no one ever wants to do arranged fights anymore. Bring your best we bring our best and lets smash it out. The old BSP vs (insertclannamehere) days. Most clan wars start with an ambush, so that is 100% fine. But for that to be your only bag of tricks. Its rough to play against.

reed23

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2017, 04:35:26 PM »
I've held off posting for a bit.  What happened the last 24 hours i'm sure the staff feels silly about.  I'll not waist my time attacking them.  The real issues need to be talked about -

What does Rise want and what is best for arctic -

As you all know, we love the rush, we love the ambush, and we love when there is a clan to go up against.  We would love nothing more than to see IlyaClan doing well and Wilds playing so there is real competition to war.  We've adjusted our play style wipe after wipe after wipe.  Hell, all it took this wipe was 1 PK, LITERALLY 1 KILLED CHARACTER, and then the imm intervening and mud slinging start.  I know that we have adjusted our play style almost 180 degrees, but still receive criticism about how we do things.  The criticism will never change.  What could change is putting together a "council" (lack of better term) of higher ups from all the main clans, and possible main clans who would consider coming back to play.  Concessions could be made, things agreed upon, etc. so that hopefully people would show up and play.  We may concede to "not ambush" for x days of the wipe, or once a war starts, here is the rulebook.  If those rules are broken, here are the consequences.  Just 1 wipe ago, we had probably our most intense 12 hours of PK with Core.  So the chatter of "those days are over" is complete bullshit.  Council of clan leaders, discuss clan interactions, what it takes for clans to play at a high level, etc.  Immortals could be there for certain reasons and to understand the terms.

Direction of Mud -

Where is this game even headed?  Are we headed for a care-bear mud where there are no limits and everyone gets a training dragon orb when they make their character?  No PK?  All gear % load?  No end-game mage spells, like WTF????? Endless grinding on skills and XP STILL?????  Supposedly skill training was revamped but it's still an utter JOKE?  Let's get our shit together and tackle these issues which would literally take only a few hours of communication.  We play the game, people in MYTH play the game, people in last wipe CORE play the game, let's get everyone's perspective and bapting get rid of the awful parts of this game.  Load rates 10% - 15%?  Seriously?  This wipe Holy Word was a cake walk to load - in fact Amity loaded 2 books in a single run LOL yet summon circle was like finding a needle a haystack?  COUNTER INTUITIVE.  On one hand we are saying that people are 30-50 with kids jobs and a lot of off-mud responsibility, yet on the other we are asking them to skill brew and scribe for 72 real hours so they can bapting legend?  Seriously?  Also, what in the hell is with the 8 man groups?  Everyone has clamored to go back to 10 - I don't get it?  Reminds me of a golf course superintendent who puts the pins in some of the most insane places on the greens to "protect" the course from good scores.  I don't remember even a single person being against going back to 10, yet here we still are banging our heads against the walls with 8 man groups and people getting left on the sidelines AGAIN.  Holy bapt.

So - My thoughts - we need the people who influence everyone on this game to get together, figure shit out, and make concessions and agreements.  They also need a voice in managing the grindiness of the game such as spell loads, gear loads, gear decay, skilling, xping, ranking, etc. 

Listen Jorquin, say the word if you don't want us to return and you'll never see any of us ever again.  If you want to code no-PK into the game, be my guest.  You can lose the group of players who show up wipe after wipe after wipe, but supposedly suppress everyone else from playing through 1 PK in the first 22 days of the wipe.

blackmagus

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #12 on: July 09, 2017, 06:29:22 PM »
A council, concessions?

Your clan has been abyssed, deleted, banned and reviled by many and despite many phony peace-talks absolutely nothing has changed. Now the the MUD has changed because you've failed to police your clan and made it known you care nothing for the results.

Now mechanics have changed and you must play nice. Should have done something sooner when you had the chance.

Ezio

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #13 on: July 09, 2017, 06:30:54 PM »
The good follows/bots learn from the experienced. If anything good could happen from this embarrassment, hopefully the old boys clubs can learn to better manage their followers and cut out their bots. There may be some good players that, if given half a chance, may be loyal and help your clan be competitive

Jang Yoo Sung

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Re: Last chance to make the game competitive once again.
« Reply #14 on: July 09, 2017, 06:33:35 PM »
on day 2 myth beat rise to storms, yes that is true
and at the same time at one point we were glad the super items didnt load
because they would only make us a target to rise

this wipe a few mythlings were harassed by rise
i for one was harassed by a rise thief trying to steal my gear
did i retaliate? no, i just recalled
a few of us were pked in week 2 and we all agreed to stay low...this is why rise is poison

rise is the only clan that wants war anymore
so although i think also agree that reducing pk damage to near 0 is kind of a big move
i think it is one worth looking into

the gods didnt take away your gear or your zoning time so stop whining and get along like myth